What does work is copying / backing up the usb stick to pc before use and then restoring the backup to a 2nd stick for the 2nd IFD. That also allows updating 2 IFDs in parallel, although I must say that since 10.2 the update time is dramatically reduced.

No, I'm not saying that.  I just said that you only need one subscription with Jeppesen.  If you have two IFDs, each cycle I would expect JDM to show that you have two downloads available.  You would download from JDM once for each IFD onto a separate USB stick.  Then, go to the aircraft with the two USB sticks and load the IFDs.

Sorry Steve, but I think you need to check your facts on that. Not sure how Jepp would know. AFAIK, the IFDs are not registered with Jepp, just the a/c reg. Perhaps true if one orders the "Jeppesen Services Suite + IFR" bundle in which case Jepp might just add the 2nd download on request since all in-panel units + IFD100 + IFD Trainer are all covered in the bundle. But that costs a small fortune.

In any case, I have an IFD540 & IFD440 and a single navdata subscription with Jepp. There is only one download available per update on JDM. When I asked Jepp about adding a 2nd IFD on the same registration in order to get 2 downloads, they said I needed to order (& pay) a 2nd subscription. Christine gave me the tip on how to make the 2nd usb stick and it works.

Interesting, since I actually did double check with my Jeppesen contact before posting that.  I'll ask again and refer to your post.  In the meantime, what is the experience of others on the forum that have two IFDs?

The full Suite + IFR is not an option for me, as it is would cost me an additional $700 just to get the same Jepp charts on the IFD540 and IFD100 that I already have on 2x ipads with ForeFlight.

I must say that I have the bundle also because of the charts and the ability to use those on multiple devices.

If it weren't for the charts I would do as Vince suggested.

I wonder though if I should go vince's path and have the charts just on foreflight as they are pretty useless on the 540. they only make sense on the IFD100 but then I hate this cropping. You can bet that I always press the wrong LSK as I always forget whether the LSK shows the status or what you will get when pressing.

I'm standing by my original post regarding this matter.  I engaged my Jeppesen contact with the following scenario:

He confirmed that every one of my assertions was correct.  If you're getting different information when ordering products from Jeppesen, you can at least be armed with these facts.

You can stick with that, but what the forum is trying to say is that many of us get different answers from each other and also different answers on different calls.  My subscription renewal was straight forward this year, but I've had to explain (almost argue) their options to them in the past, which is not acceptable.

Steve,

As I understand you, I was overcharged by Jeppesen.  I have two IFD440s and an EX5000 MFD.  I want navdata for these three units and the IFD100 (no Jepp charts).  Last August I purchased annual subscriptions for US navdata and was charged 2 * $325 = $650 for the two IFDs and $245 for the EX5000.  As I now understand you, I should have been charged only $325 + $245, and each update cycle JDM will give me 2 downloads for the IFDs and 1 for the EX5000.  Correct?

Thanks.

-Larry

I do not have a Jepp chart subscription; for charts I use ForeFlight.  I have three Jepp subscriptions:  NavData Americas for the EX5000 and two NavData IFR Full USA for the IFDs. The Jepp representative attempted to sell me on a chart subscription, which I declined.  I was not forceful about paying for the two IFD subscriptions because I was inexperienced with what Jepp service had been negotiated by Avidyne; in my previous plane I had a single IFD550.

I don't find the charts (approach plates) all that useful on the IFD and prefer to view them in Foreflight or other EFB on my iPad. When I was talking to their tech support maybe 6 months ago, the charts cost was on the same order of magnitude as the NavData, on top of the NavData price. 

More miscommunication by Jepp, everybody gets a different answer.  Personally I don't know why anybody would pay for charts on the IFD.  I have whole US navdata only and have charts/maps on 2 different tablets.

I was under the impression that as long as you had the navdata at the same level between the IFD540 and IFD100, they'd sync up even without plates.  Are you saying that I'd have to pay for charts to be able to use the IFD100 at all?

Thanks, Steve.  I had not understood the difference between bundles and a la carte.  I had indeed ordered a la carte, after taking into account charts, obstacles, and terrain for my situation.

-Larry

It's true that as long as the IFD and the IFD100 have the same nav data, flight plans would be shared regardless of any charts.  But, you cannot get mobile device support to load your iPad without a bundle, and a bundle includes charts.  Without the same nav data, you can still use the IFD100, but it's utility would be limited since flight plans would not be shared.

Jeppesen quoted me >$1000 more for the bundle than I'm paying today for IFD540 navdata plus Jepp charts on ForeFlight (Europe IFR/VFR coverage).... that means just to get charts, obstacles, and terrain on the IFDs. Maybe others can justify that, but for my C172 that puts the IFD100 out of my league.

I haven't tried to use the IFD100 with my IFD540. So far, using the 540 alone has been enough. I tend to use Foreflight or WingX Pro on my iPad. My plane is getting its annual inspection. I will play around with the IFD100 after I get it back. 

I have the IFD540/440 with a Jeppesen navdata sub only (two units)

I don't know what "mobile device support" means but I get the navdata downloaded to the iPad IFD100.

I can plan and transfer flight plans from the iPad to the panel etc.

For the record, below was the position previously.  I know I instigated the same conversation last time, but I just want to make sure things haven't changed - in case I ever decide to buy an over-priced single-purpose piece of hardware.

AviJake wrote: I think the frenzy we've whipped ourselves up to on this forum is unwarranted. Everything syncs between the IFD100 and the panel mount IFDs exactly as it does with two panel mount IFDs.  The only thing that requires consistent databases between the units to sync is nav data. For those of you who pay for Nav data and are legal to fly IFR using the IFDs, you will have the IFD100 Nav data upload sync'd with your IFDs as part of your Nav Data purchase. For those of you who don't pay for Nav data and use the expired data on your panel mount IFDs, all you have to do is ensure the nav data cycle on the IFD100 is the same expired cycle to allow nav data to sync.   We of course don't recommend using expired nav data for flight operations but if you choose to do so, we'll ensure you have the same cycle of nav data on your IFD100.

I now also have the Jepp charts on Foreflight so I can see the same thing on that as on the IFD. No extra cost with my $1000 package from Jepp for east of the Mississippi coverage - but what a ridiculous price to pay for charts. Back when it was books, my Jepp subscription for the same coverage was nowhere near this much.

+1

The rep initially offered whole US NavData, Obstacles and Terrain for $565 or so (can't remember the exact number), but then he said he misspoke. That they had this bundle for the IFD-440, but did not apply to the 540. He said it was probably an oversight and maybe they will eventually have such a bundle for the 540 too. I sure hope they do. Nav+Obstacles is currently $480+$185 for me.

Is there anything Avidyne can do on their side to get Jepp to offer the same IFD-440 bundle for the 540?

They also offered me Jepp charts for the iPad for $199 for the US plus an additional $195 for the rest of the Americas. Even the rep said he thought the iPad provided a larger and better presentation than the panel mount navigators.

OK, it was more like halftime than a timeout, but I got it all worked out…

In original implementations, Jeppesen had their mobile (i.e. iPad) licensing model tied to the availability of charts.  The documentation I had was based on that model.  Since that time, they have changed their model such that mobile licensing is independent of charts, thus allowing mobile apps like the IFD100 to access subscriptions that contained only nav data.

To be sure everything works as we expected, Jeppesen tested various typical subscriptions, including both bundled and ala carte data, with and without charts.  They verified that all of the subscriptions were available on the IFD100 app.  They also agreed that it was the right thing to do, so those of you that were worried something might be taken away can now eliminate that worry.  The bottom line is that the data you've purchased for your avionics will also be available on your iPad for use with the IFD100.

That's a different problem.  You can only download the data on a limited number of devices.  If I remember correctly, the bundles support up to four mobile devices.  If you have run out of seats, you need to deactivate one of the other devices and then you'll be able to load data on the iPad hosting your IFD100 app.  Can you account for all of the devices which you have activated?

It seems confusion reigns at Jeppesen! I see others do have a 440 subscription to use on their 540. I'll look into it when my renewal comes up in October. For the time being, I switched to an Americas NavData and Obstacles subscription because I am traveling to Mexico soon. They claim to not have any bundles for those databases. 

I got a similar response from the woman who was assisting me.  Since I had several weeks left on my current subscription, she asked me to hold off on completing the transaction while she "tried to get this cleared up on our end".  I'm not holding my breath, but if she's unsuccessful in getting a no-charts bundle approved for the 540, I'm going to try to get her to sell me the 440 bundle.

Not sure this is helpful, but I've had the 540 bundle (for which I paid $1100ish the first two years, then $990 last year). My renewal was due today so yesterday I called and spoke to Barbara. I told her I wanted the 440 bundle; she went off and pushed some buttons for a few minutes and came back to tell me the 440 bundle was $580. Sold.

"Call 3 times, get 4 different answers" must be their motto.

The rep did say Jepp was talking to Avidyne, and they were wanting to put more bundles together, maybe by Sun'n'Fun or Oshkosh. We'll see if something happens next week.

I have a friend with a Garmin 430 NavData subscription (no charts). He was given a free Charts seat to use in ForeFlight. I inquired about that, and that is a Garmin-specific bundle. Hopefully Avidyne can get a similar deal in place. I'd also like to see an Americas NavData, Obstacles and Terrain bundle, not just full US.

She did not know anything about what might have been announced at Sun n Fun. She said maybe when their sales people come back next week she'll know more.

Fun fact: two weeks ago I had Jepp renew me for the 440 bundle, even though I had the 540 bundle before. I still have access to Jepp charts in FF, for no good reason that I can see.

I have Jepp charts in multiple places, in the 540, the G* 796 and a tablet (and laptop in the family room). Use each differently, and in a pinch most can sub for another. The Jepp Avidyne bundle gives me all those plates everywhere, and they are all in the same format, even no matter what country.

In the 540, I always activate the default plan view of the Jepp chart in the 540. I like seeing the graphical georeferencing and flight plan overlay, and that is what I mainly use it for. With an approach loaded, on landing, the 540 will automatically flip over to the Jepp airport view, which nicely backs up my 796 SafeTaxi view.

I would be very leery of having only one source of plates, especially if that source was a general purpose tablet.

I'm a belt & suspenders guy.

* Orest

Rolfe

I like the chart loaded on the IFD540.  I do not toggle through pages to access information.  I load the entire chart ("VIEW ALL"), zoom-in to about 2.0, and then have whatever I want by just swiping around.  It works quite well and is readable.  So, while I do prefer to use the IFD100 to do approach briefings, the IFD540 provides good usable redundancy.  Also, Like Orest, I like to see the flight plan overlaid on the chart to confirm where the FP will take me and what the required altitudes are.  Of course, I can do this all on the IFD100, but there are times when I'm just not bothering with another device or I may not even have it with me.  I have one subscription to maintain, Jeppesen, with redundant options on IFD540, IFD100, and a computer.  I can also print hard copies or have a trip kit on a thumb drive with PDF copies for use on any device that I may want.  I have the options I need and it all works quite well.

Nice that you an afford it. It would cost me an additional €700+ to get those charts on my IFD Europe subscription. Very expensive suspenders! I prefer to keep the free versions of the charts (non-Jepp) available as backup, even if it means a different chart format per country compared to the Jepp standardization of my FF subscription. The gold-plated Jepp backup isn't needed often enough for my taste to justify the extra cost.

Canadian data/charts are a good multiple compared to the US, but from what I've seen the Euro prices are out of this world.

Perhaps in your shoes I might do the same.

* Orest

It's a longshot, but check to make sure the tail number in your 540 matches the tail number in your 550.

You mentioned that you bought a "bundle". The bundle might be Charts, Nav, Obstacle and Terrain for one unit. 

Regardless of what you bought, you can't just download it once on a USB drive and then update both IFDs. If you have two IFDs then you should use two different USB drives.

Your Jepp subscription should show both IFDs if you bought a subscription for both.

Anyway - I finally spoke to a rep that took an hour to renew the nav, obstacle, and the Florida charts subscription.  I initially downloaded all 3 via jdm, but the 540 barfed on the chart file.

Thinking it was a corrupted file, I called and had them reset the download, but now on JDM, I do not show a chart download.  When I called, she said I was sold a 'mobile only' chart subscription, so she charged me a few more dollars and gave me a 'CSX' code to pair my device with a Jepp code she supplied.

I'm supposed to now take the code she gave me, and my serial number of the IFD540 to get a new code. The problem is the web site needs an 8 character serial number and my IFD540 has a 10 character serial number. I then need to enter the new 'CSX' code into my 540 where the charts will then magically appear.  Is it me, or did she sell me a subscription for something other than an IFD540?

I am on an older base software version 10.1.2.0 as I'm waiting for my local shop to get the latest version..

Could she have said "CMax" code versus "CSX"?  If so, I think she sold you a subscription for an EX5000 MFD.  You need to call them back and have them correct their mistake.

Since I posted this, she e-mailed me back and said that 'based on my serial number', I should be able to download it through JDM.

Even though I asked her last night specifically why I didn't see the chart option in JDM.

WOW - I would buy a subscription from literally ANYONE that would compete with Jepp at this point.