Self Exchange of IFD540s and 440s
Printed From: Avidyne
Category: Avidyne General
Forum Name: IFD 5 Series & IFD 4 Series Touch Screen GPS/NAV/COM
Forum Description: Topics on Avidyne's IFD 5 Series and IFD 4 Series Touch Screen GPS/NAV/COM
URL: http://forums.avidyne.com/forum_posts.asp?TID=1066
Printed Date: 05 May 2024 at 8:40am Software Version: Web Wiz Forums 12.01 - http://www.webwizforums.com
Topic: Self Exchange of IFD540s and 440s
Posted By: AviJake
Subject: Self Exchange of IFD540s and 440s
Date Posted: 09 May 2016 at 5:37pm
We recently read an online story in the aviation ePubs of the world (page 22 of the April 2016 edition of Aviation Consumer) where the author talked about using CFAR14 Part 43.3 and Part 43 Appendix A Preventative Maintenance as perhaps a means to help lower the overall cost of avionics and thought that was an interesting idea.
So we did some homework including running it by the FAA and concluded it was a viable approach and then produced an IFD-series navigator self-exchange guide the provides step-by-step instructions on how to do this. The document starts with a 10-step test that determines if you and your airplane meet the qualifications to take advantage of this process.
If you pass those 10 criteria questions, then the rest of the document provides explicit instructions on how to accomplish the process and make the appropriate log book entries.
The document can be downloaded at: http://www.avidyne.com/support/doctype.asp?doctype=installation+manual&list=doc" rel="nofollow - http://www.avidyne.com/support/doctype.asp?doctype=installation+manual&list=doc
Is there anyone out there who meets the criteria and is interested in trying this out? We would be quite interested in hearing feedback and be on-call for the effort. We suspect this will appeal to a small segment of folks and may be controversial in other areas - we are not trying to stir up any trouble but hope to provide this as a tool to help manage the cost of avionics upgrades.
The guide is intended to instruct aircraft owners how to replace a Garmin GNS430(W)/530(W) with an Avidyne IFD440 or IFD540. It must be a true plug & play installation meaning you can not use it to go from non-WAAS to WAAS or add any more wiring or parts.
For reference, I've included the 10 qualification criteria below:
If you can answer “Yes” (or directed to skip the question) to each of the questions below, then
you are permitted to perform this exchange on your own in accordance with CFAR
14 Part 43.3 and Part 43 Appendix A.
If you answer “No” or “I don’t know” to any of these
questions/tests then it is unlikely you are permitted to perform this exchange
on your own and you should consult an approved installation shop. Avidyne Customer Support can supply the list
of approved installation shops, if needed.
1
|
Are you a holder of a United
States pilot certificate?
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Yes
|
No
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2
|
Do you own or operate the aircraft
(fixed wing or rotary wing) in question and is it registered in the US
(N-reg)?
|
Yes
|
No
|
3
|
Can you confirm the aircraft in
question is NOT operated
under CFAR 14 Part 121 (Air Carrier), 129 (Foreign Air Carrier) or 135
(Commuter or On-Demand Operations)?
|
Yes
|
No
|
4
|
The Garmin unit that you want to
replace with an Avidyne IFD4XX or IFD5XX unit satisfies one of the acceptable
combinations in the table immediately below these questions?
|
Yes
|
No
|
5
|
Can you confirm the Garmin unit
being replaced does NOT
currently have a TAWS (fixed wing) or HTAWS (rotary wing) capability?
Note: this can be determined by
turning on the Garmin and noting if the TAWS system in displayed on the start
up screens.
|
Yes
|
No
|
6
|
If you are replacing a WAAS-capable Garmin unit (e.g. GPS 400W, GNS
430W, GPS 500W, GNS 530W) then you can skip this question.
Can you confirm that the aircraft
is question does NOT have a
Garmin GA56 GPS antenna (Part # 010-10040-01 or 011-00134-00) connected to
the unit to be replaced?
Note: GA56W and GA56A antennas are perfectly
acceptable.
|
Yes
|
No
|
7
|
If your Garmin unit is powered by 28VDC, then you can skip this
question.
If you are replacing a GPS400(W) with an IFD410 or replacing a
GPS500(W) with an IFD510 then you can skip this question.
Can you confirm that electrical
bus that the IFD will be connected to is either a 28V ± 3V system OR that if it is connected to
a 14V ± 3V system, then the circuit breakers guarding the IFD unit are at
least 7.5 A?
|
Yes
|
No
|
8
|
Can you confirm that to the best
of your knowledge, there are no known installation problems (e.g. bent pins,
inability to seat in the tray, etc) with the Garmin unit you intend to replace and that it works well
enough to record the configuration settings in it?
|
Yes
|
No
|
9
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Do you have a 3/32” allen wrench
available?
Note: There should have been a proper allen
wrench included with the IFD unit.
|
Yes
|
No
|
10
|
Do you have the aircraft log books
available?
|
Yes
|
No
|
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
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Replies:
Posted By: Gring
Date Posted: 09 May 2016 at 8:25pm
Wow, that is interesting. I would think that most GNS-W devices in the smaller GA aircraft would apply.
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Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 09 May 2016 at 8:42pm
We think that might be correct if folks elect to do this on their own and then the next time they're in the shop, they elect to add some of the optional wiring that requires an avionics shop for most folks (like adding wiring to that audio panel to hear the aurals). We'll see.
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
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Posted By: Gring
Date Posted: 09 May 2016 at 9:01pm
Hey, on the Exchange guide, question 1) Are you a holder of a US pilot certificate? I might add (except Student Pilot) since student pilots aren't allowed to do PM per FAR part 43.
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Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 09 May 2016 at 9:02pm
okay, good point
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
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Posted By: brou0040
Date Posted: 09 May 2016 at 10:26pm
I think this is a great idea. I'd suggest adding a section that discusses warranty. Currently your http://www.avidyne.com/support/warranty.asp" rel="nofollow - warranty policy states: - the Product is returned to us via an Avidyne Distributor;
I think potential customers may also be concerned with how a hardware failure will be resolved. My unit was sent back multiple times under warranty and I didn't care who "covered it" regarding if it were the installing shop or Avidyne. If I became the installing shop, I'd be a bit more concerned about how this would be handled.
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Posted By: chflyer
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 5:48am
How would this meet the STC requirement to have a 337 form signed off by an A&P/IA and submitted to the FAA?
------------- Vince
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Posted By: dubs
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 7:34am
As I found when my IFD440 was installed, if the TAWS Out audio channel is not wired from he IFD440 to the Audio Panel, Aural Alerts will not be heard. So, if someone is slide-in replacing an IFD440 for a Non-Taws 430, I don't think they will have the benefit of Aural Alerts form the IFD440. Is that correct?
------------- Baron C55 Tulsa, OK
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Posted By: tony
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 7:41am
sounds like this could be the basis of a 540 - 550 exchange program......
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Posted By: Gring
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 7:53am
dubs wrote:
As I found when my IFD440 was installed, if the TAWS Out audio channel is not wired from he IFD440 to the Audio Panel, Aural Alerts will not be heard. So, if someone is slide-in replacing an IFD440 for a Non-Taws 430, I don't think they will have the benefit of Aural Alerts form the IFD440. Is that correct?
|
Correct, if you want additional features of the IFD series then you need additional wiring. The guide Steve referenced explains this.
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Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 8:41am
chflyer wrote:
How would this meet the STC requirement to have a 337 form signed off by an A&P/IA and submitted to the FAA? |
There is no STC involved in this activity. This is a preventative maintenance action.
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
|
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 8:45am
brou0040 wrote:
I think this is a great idea. I'd suggest adding a section that discusses warranty. Currently your http://www.avidyne.com/support/warranty.asp" rel="nofollow - warranty policy states: - the Product is returned to us via an Avidyne Distributor;
I think potential customers may also be concerned with how a hardware failure will be resolved. My unit was sent back multiple times under warranty and I didn't care who "covered it" regarding if it were the installing shop or Avidyne. If I became the installing shop, I'd be a bit more concerned about how this would be handled.
|
Sounds like a good idea. I'll look at adding some appropriate text in the next week or two.
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
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Posted By: pburger
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 10:17am
tony wrote:
sounds like this could be the basis of a 540 - 550 exchange program...... |
There ya go!
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Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 10 May 2016 at 10:20am
The Sales guys expect to publish the details of the 540 to 550 upgrade program around mid-week next week (~17 May).
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
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Posted By: DavidBunin
Date Posted: 12 May 2016 at 8:07am
Steve,
I know it seems like a great idea, but as an A&P and IA, I have some experience here. The core problem is this: The action being performed is not preventive maintenance. It is an alteration to the aircraft (albeit a minor one). The aircraft's Equipment List must be revised to indicate the new inventory of components.
Alterations are not within the authority of a Pilot. (Pilots should not be revising the Equipment List.) One must at least be the holder of an Airframe Mechanic license to perform a minor alteration on an airframe.
In the FAA's regulatory world, there are five "kinds of things" that can happen to an airplane, and these things are covered under different sections of the FARs and may be performed by individuals of increasing levels of certification: 1) Preventive Maintenance 2) Maintenance 3) Alteration (Minor & Major) 4) Repair (Minor & Major) 5) Inspections
Changing from a 530 to a 540 is in bucket #3, not bucket #1.
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
That said, I have two comments: I would be interested in seeing the table referenced in question #4. Question #7 seems self-contradictory. If the Garmin was 28 volts, then you skip the question. So why is a 28 volt condition part of the question?
David Bunin
|
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 12 May 2016 at 8:14am
Hi David,
We strongly disagree with the assertion that this is not Preventative Maintenance and we have agreement within the FAA. I can understand how some folks will be perfectly comfortable with this vehicle and some will not. We're just trying to provide the choice/option/path. If you qualify and want to go for it, great. If not, no problem.
Reference your question on #4, I've pasted it in below (note that the IFD410 and IFD510 are not yet available).
With question #7, by definition, the 28V aircraft already come with the proper amperage circuit breaker so those owners don't even need to think about that issue.
Table for #4: The following table describes the acceptable exchange
combinations:
Device
to be Removed
|
Acceptable
Exchange Device
|
GPS 400, GPS 400W (any variant)
|
IFD410
|
GNS 430, GNS 430W (any variant,
but 14V units need proper circuit breaker sizing (7.5A) in order to proceed)
|
IFD440
|
GPS 500, GPS 500W (any variant)
|
IFD510
|
GNS 530, GNS 530W (any variant
except TAWS, but 14V units need proper circuit breaker sizing (7.5A) in order
to proceed)
|
IFD540
|
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
|
Posted By: DavidBunin
Date Posted: 12 May 2016 at 8:29am
AviJake wrote:
With question #7, by definition, the 28V aircraft already come with the proper amperage circuit breaker so those owners don't even need to think about that issue. |
Okay, I understand and that makes sense. The question is really only for owners of 14v airplanes.
So then why is "28v+/-3" one of the conditional answers? Nobody is going to have that voltage in a 14v airplane.
It might be clearer to just ask if the circuit breaker is rated for at least 7.5 amps in a 14v installation.
David Bunin
|
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 12 May 2016 at 8:31am
Yup, I agree that would be clearer. I'll make that mod too. Thanks.
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
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Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 12 May 2016 at 8:33am
BTW, here's a snippet from the Exchange Manual that cites the FAR basis that formed the core of the argument for anyone interested:
This section contains
snippets of the relevant portions of 14 CFR Part 43 that serve as the
regulatory basis for this exchange process.
14CFR Part 43
describes aircraft maintenance, preventive maintenance, rebuilding and
alteration.
Sec.
43.3
Persons authorized to perform maintenance, preventive maintenance, rebuilding,
and alterations.
(g)
Except for holders of a sport pilot certificate, the holder of a pilot certificate issued under part 61
may perform preventive maintenance on any aircraft owned or operated by that
pilot which is not used under part 121, 129, or 135 of this chapter. The
holder of a sport pilot certificate may perform preventive maintenance on an
aircraft owned or operated by that pilot and issued a special airworthiness
certificate in the light-sport category.
(5)
The items of preventive maintenance authorized by this section are those listed
in paragraph (c) of appendix A of this part.
Major
alterations, Major Repairs and Preventive maintenance are described in 14CFR
Part 43 Appendix A.
(c)
Preventive maintenance. Preventive maintenance is limited to the
following work, provided it does not involve complex assembly operations:
(31) Removing and replacing self-contained, front
instrument panel-mounted navigation and communication devices that employ
tray-mounted connectors that connect the unit when the unit is installed into
the instrument panel,
(excluding automatic flight control systems, transponders, and microwave
frequency distance measuring equipment (DME)). The approved unit must be
designed to be readily and repeatedly removed and replaced, and pertinent
instructions must be provided. Prior to the unit's intended use, an operational
check must be performed in accordance with the applicable sections of part 91
of this chapter.
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
|
Posted By: DavidBunin
Date Posted: 12 May 2016 at 9:01am
I will repeat that in MY PROFESSIONAL OPINION this is an aircraft alteration (albeit a very minor one). Steve says that Avidyne has agreement from "the FAA" but we don't know which office or individual that comes from, and it doesn't mean that every FSDO will see it the same way. If your FSDO is on board, great! I'm all for it.
On the other hand, if you are in the Dallas area, I would prefer to offer my services (free of charge, I am not financially motivated here) as an A&P/IA to legally supervise you doing this work and thus remove any doubt.
Most of the maintenance I do is owner-assisted, and I find that even the guys who are technically savvy and capable in the hangar, still need my help to make a good maintenance log entry for the books.
I love the Avidyne products and Team. I want nothing but success for all of us. If you and your FSDO are comfortable with the method proposed here then you're all set. If you or your FSDO are not comfortable with it, call me and I'd love to help you get an Avidyne product into your panel.
David Bunin
|
Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 12 May 2016 at 12:07pm
HQ FAA/AFS (Flight Standards) is "the FAA" who are fine with it. Not sure you can do much better than that.
It's akin to what TKM is doing for the owner replacement of BK-175 Nav/Coms.
We also include the log book sticker (and extraction tool) in the ship kit for those who want to give this a shot.
David's approach sounds like a good belt & suspenders approach for those who still aren't comfortable on their own. I would agree this is not for everyone but for some folks, I think this is an awesome option.
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
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Posted By: tony
Date Posted: 12 May 2016 at 2:06pm
I applaud Avidyne for leaning forward on this, along with many design features in the IFDs that frankly I'm astonished the FAA would certify. Lets just see where this goes before we throw say it cant be done.
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Posted By: Kentucky Captain
Date Posted: 13 May 2016 at 1:49am
What about software updates? Is that something that will ever be available at the user level or is the process too fraught with the possibility of bricking the unit?
I replace firmware on computer components all the time and very rarely turn one into a door stop. Actually, it's been years since that has happened. I don't know if the hardware has gotten more bullet proof or the firmware has gotten that much better.
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Posted By: AviJake
Date Posted: 13 May 2016 at 5:31am
I am a lot less optimistic that will come to pass anytime soon.
------------- Steve Jacobson sjacobson@avidyne.com
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Posted By: DavidBunin
Date Posted: 13 May 2016 at 10:56am
That is an interesting paradox.
I do find it weird that the FAA has agreed that replacing a navigation/communication system with a different (and BETTER) navigation/communication system is not an alteration, but they balk at software loading on an existing system (which the pilot does every 28 days). The new software is an alteration, but the new hardware with the new software isn't? They aren't bothered that the IFD-540 does not share any software with the GNS530W?
Remember, I am a supporter. I want this to work out for everybody.
Here is another detail: the flight manual supplement. If your airplane has an Approved Flight Manual (AFM) then the navigation system pages are an Approved Flight Manual Supplement (AFMS). To remove the Garmin AFMS and insert the Avidyjne AFMS is a change to approved data (the AFM). That is the piece that usually puts this into the realm of major alteration, and the reason for a 337 and the involvement of an IA.
The slide-in Nav/Com radios from TKM do not encounter this stumbling block because most of those older planes did not have an AFM.
David Bunin
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Posted By: FlyingCOham
Date Posted: 13 May 2016 at 6:01pm
An observation about firmware updates. We've found that 99% of the A&Ps don't know much about sophisticated electronics or the idea of what a firmware update really is. We have the A&P on sight when we do the install and have him read the instructions to us and watch us do it. We do all the install, he watches and signs off the install was done IAW the SB, and everybody's happy.
------------- Jim Patton
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Posted By: Kentucky Captain
Date Posted: 15 May 2016 at 11:02pm
I do find it weird that the FAA has agreed that replacing a
navigation/communication system with a different (and BETTER)
navigation/communication system is not an alteration, but they balk at
software loading on an existing system (which the pilot does every 28
days). The new software is an alteration, but the new hardware with the
new software isn't? They aren't bothered that the IFD-540 does not
share any software with the GNS530W?
As I was saying on another thread in this forum, I worked for the FAA for 27 years and I never did figure them out. I was most suprised to see the approval of the Dynon DA-10 for certified aircraft. That seemed to fly right into the limelight. Most of the stuff the FAA does is akin to watching paint dry. Actually, since paint does actually dry, that statement is not fair to paint.
You are correct in that we already do updates when we load the Jeppesen data every 28 days. It's not like it's rocket surgery. They send detailed instructions that would put some microwave tv dinner instructions to shame.
I've had firmware updates on computer hardware that came with no instructions and you were left to figure it out on your own. One wrong move and "Brick".
I certainly wouldn't mind doing it myself as long as I was able to talk to someone if there was an issue and not give me a lot of attitude if something did turn it into a toaster.
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Posted By: ksdoc
Date Posted: 12 Nov 2016 at 10:05am
Pirep on a 440 exchange. Just completed my exchange and it couldn't have gone easier. I read the Avidyne self install manual carefully, took pictures of the 430 settings, had Christine from Tech support on the phone for help and got it all done in less than 45 minutes. I did an initial albeit short flight but everything looks great. Glad to see something works as advertised. Look forward to v10.2!
------------- kansasdoc
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