1090 Receiver

Avidyne at Sun N Fun said no SkyTrax or MLB200 (Dual Band) in the future

LANCE wrote: Avidyne at Sun N Fun said no SkyTrax or MLB200 (Dual Band) in the future

In my humble opinion, I think that's a mistake.

LANCE wrote: Avidyne at Sun N Fun said no SkyTrax or MLB200 (Dual Band) in the future

brou0040 wrote: AviSimpson wrote: With 10.2, we are compatible with the GTX345 which is dual-band. Additionally, L3 has listed our IFD as a compatible display for their Lynx, which is also dual-band. AviSimpson, thanks for the heads up about those units, but this thread is about dual band receivers.  Support for those units and not a dual receiver makes those of us who purchased an AXP340 wish we bought a product from one of your competitors...

+1

AviSimpson wrote: LANCE wrote: Avidyne at Sun N Fun said no SkyTrax or MLB200 (Dual Band) in the future I wouldn't rule anything out in the future.

Here's hoping ... and for sooner rather than later.



Edited by bellanca1730a - 18 Apr 2017 at 6:38am

Gary T wrote: ADS-B Interface Avidyne TAS605A/TAS615A/ TAS620A (Traffic) Avidyne SkyTrax 100/200/210 What is a Skytrax 200/ 210 ???

SkyTrax 100 is the receive-only box for ADS-B traffic and weather on 978MHz.
SkyTrax 200 is a transmitter and receiver (UAT) for ADS-B Out and In on 978MHz, using an external GPS (IFD/GNS/GTN) as the position source.
SkyTrax 210 is a transmitter and receiver (UAT) for ADS-B Out and In on 978MHz, using a built-in GPS as the position source.  In other words, this is a stand-alone unit.

The 200 and 210 are not available yet.

Some of us still have hope (faded, though it may be) that all of these products will have an upgrade path to receive dual-band someday.  But for now they are 978-only receivers.

AviSimpson wrote: The SkyTrax200 & 210 will not be coming out in the aforementioned form. There is little to no demand in the market for a 978 Out transceiver.

I replaced my 530W with an IFD540 this month and will be going in in June to have a Garmin 345 installed in my Twin Comanche.  I would have preferred to go with Avidyne ADS-B equipment for the sake of future compatibility, but the Garmin makes much more sense at this point.  The Garmin has many more features than the Avidyne does including tablet display of weather and traffic and dual band ADS-B in, it is a one box solution which simplifies installation, and the cost is lower than the combined cost of an Avidyne transponder and their Skytrax100 box.  Seems to me that Avidyne needs to take a serious look at their ADS-B products and pricing if they are going to be competitive.

DavidBunin wrote: I....But in order to "be seen" I would need to have a dual-band transmitter, which as far as I know is not offered or proposed by any manufacturer, or I would need two transmitters which some airplanes seem to have. Just thinking out loud.

oskrypuch wrote: DavidBunin wrote: I....But in order to "be seen" I would need to have a dual-band transmitter... Well, there is a TAS solution available ... My TAS605 is a real performer, and you can send traffic data to any panel mount device from it,

That does NOTHING to help other pilots/aircraft see me.

Imagine that the other traffic only has a UAT installed.  That guy won't see me unless I am transmitting on 978MHz.  (In this scenario, we are both in the pattern at an airport outside/below network coverage altitude.)

Of course, if I have a dual-band receiver that equipment will detect his target and display it for me.  But his equipment would not detect me if I only broadcast on 1090MHz.

My point is that "see and be seen" contains a serious flaw in a dual-band environment.  And dual-band receivers only solve half of the problem.

ADS-R solves the problem at altitude, but most so-called "mid-air" collisions don't really happen in the middle of the air.  They happen mostly in the traffic pattern or on short final when two aircraft attempt to use one runway.  Exactly the place where the network drops you off and says, "Thanks, see you next time."

Of course, most of those places are well-outside rule airspace.  And I am starting to get the impression that there are more "rancher pilots" than the FAA thought.  Those pilots simply won't equip for ADS-B because they don't use rule airspace.  These are the same guys who exercise their option not to use a radio to announce their position, and their airplane probably doesn't have any kind of traffic display system in the first place.

I guess I'm just "not feeling it" this morning.  Sorry guys.

AviSimpson wrote: SkyTrax 100 is the receive-only box for ADS-B traffic and weather on 978MHz. Some of us still have hope (faded, though it may be) that all of these products will have an upgrade path to receive dual-band someday.  But for now they are 978-only receivers.

supposedly a software defined radio exists within the existing Navworx/Skytrax box which could activate a 1090 receive function.

Edited by ddgates - 02 Jun 2017 at 6:15pm

DavidBunin wrote: mccdeuce wrote: I really do think it is important for the SkyTrax to be upgraded to dual band on the ADSB-In  - the Avidyne transponder is 1090 after all.... While I agree with the desire to have the SkyTrax be a dual-band receiver, it really doesn't matter what band transmitter is installed. The ADS-B Out message format includes bits that inform the network of the aircraft's receiving capabilities.  So when your airplane advertises itself as being capable of receiving on 978 only, it doesn't matter if that advertisement goes out on 978 or 1090. The advent of dual-band receivers did not occur until years after the final equipment specifications were set and published.  The people who wrote the specs did not anticipate that market move, so the network is specifically designed to handle single-band receivers. I expect that in another decade or two, the marketplace will be populated by third-generation ADS-B products, and that virtually all of those will include dual-band receivers.   Unfortunately, we all can't wait to equip.  If we could wait (if there wasn't a 2020 mandate) then there would never even have been first-generation products. David Bunin

DavidBunin wrote: True, but the ADS-B network (and mandate) isn't designed for you or me.  It is designed for air traffic control, and they don't care about uncontrolled airspace.

Well, "boonies" isn't synonymous with uncontrolled, and for the purposes of this thread (at least my own selfish ones) I'd rather Avidyne see more interest than disinterest in a dual-band solution so they have business incentive to pursue it.

Edited by bellanca1730a - 04 Jun 2017 at 1:48am

DavidBunin wrote: I'm totally with you on that front.  I WANT to add dual-band receiving software to my SkyTrax unit.  I know the hardware is already there.  It's just a matter of motivating NavWorx to make it an engineering and certification priority.

I haven't seen a circuit schematic, so I can't comment on the physical embodiment.  But I have been told that there is receiving circuitry on the boards that are tuned for 1090MHz.  Also, NavWorx makes a device called a TransMON which links their UAT to an existing transponder.  The TransMON contains a 1090 receiver/decoder.  So they obviously know how to make a receiver.

DavidBunin wrote: Not sure how to translate "underwater with magical thinking".

ddgates wrote: DavidBunin wrote: Not sure how to translate "underwater with magical thinking".   meaning a number of new product announcements which are questionably deliverable.  Adding one more (albeit rebadged) has even less probability of fulfillment.

n7ifr wrote: That's a pretty harsh AD for NavWorx.  Assume it does not apply to our SkyTrax100. Tom W.

Edited by AviSimpson - 08 Jun 2017 at 9:21am

n7ifr wrote: That's a pretty harsh AD for NavWorx.

Actually, I think it is about as cooperative as I have ever witnessed from the FAA.

1) They waited to publish the AD until after NavWorx had submitted the certification data package for the new units.
2) They gave the AD an effectivity date that allows the FAA enough time to approve the submitted data.
3) They gave enough compliance time for operators to perform an orderly upgrade.
4) They said that there would be AMOC coverage available for solutions not currently listed on the AD.

I have never seen them be that nice to a manufacturer.  Sounds like they reconsidered their original position on the topic quite a bit.

David Bunin

Edited by Stiletto1 - 04 Sep 2017 at 7:26am

bobcain wrote: I didn't see that you received any response on this.  But a little on this line- Does anyone know if the IFD can provide position for the GDL88 like it can the GTX345?

Kelly,

brou0040 wrote: Avidyne, Any word on a dual band ADS-B receiver that can display weather and traffic on an IFD?