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ddgates View Drop Down
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    Posted: 14 Oct 2018 at 11:24pm
Anybody get their TAS back from -A upgrade with loss of audio?

Normally on boot there is a “Ground Mode” Annunciation.  Since removal, upgrade, and reinstall this is gone, but the manual says it should still do this.

Secondly, there is no audio CAS alerting.  The visuals shows up on the IFD, but no audio.

It could just be that a pin needs reseating.  We are checking this.

Avi - is there any config settings which could have been modified during the upgrade?

Thanks


Edited by ddgates - 14 Oct 2018 at 11:25pm
David Gates
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2018 at 3:41pm
See my prior post.

Seems that the TAS-A software update has a problem in that configuration settings (which should be set and forget) are volatile and can reset to default on boot up without notice.  This leaves a situation where you can assume you are going to have audible traffic alerts, but they have become inaudible.  The only way to readjust the input volume is to open up the empennage, attach a laptop with a terminal comm program, and reset the value to whatever it was.  Only to find, however, it may reset to inaudible next boot, or several boots in the future.

Avi has done a Service Letter Bulletin with a *.bin file to lock the config files, citing issues with config resets, particularly audio.

I will bet most owners are not aware of this SB.  It involves adjusting the audio volume, and then rebooting the unit from the external micro SD slot with the bin file.

This issue became obvious in my install.  Adjust the audio to a comfortable volume, shut down the unit - would think all good, right?  Not so fast, cowboy.  In my case, the adjustment got undone on subsequent boot cycles, and since had to get a technician, open the empennage, and repeat the cycle.

Now, a fellow Avi owner with the same configuration as mine except different comm panel has lost his audio too.  So now he gets to repeat the cycle.

This is a safety of flight issue.  A pilot assuming he/she has audible alerting and then, well, maybe not, is at risk.  

I am posting on this to alert other TAS-A upgrade owners that in the case of the TAS-A, silence isn’t goldden, and may indicate a problem.
David Gates
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 09 Dec 2018 at 5:08pm
David,
Thank you for posting this very critical Safety-of-Flight Avidyne issue.

Yes, I am the other owner with the same exact panel as yours (except for the Audio Panel).  

During the TAS-A upgrade, my installer and I configured the box for proper Audio Volume, but then on subsequent flights, NO AUDIO ALERTS have been heard despite close traffic encounters and visible alerts on the dual Aspens and dual IFD's... Even more shocking has been to learn that Avidyne has already written a subsequent and as of yet, unannounced SB file fix to repair this software volatility.

There has been no communication by Avidyne with me as their customer of this product, despite Avidyne knowing full well of this safety of flight issue and its software fix.  This Fix is very convoluted and likely again will involve paying an installer to correct Avidyne's induced problems from lack of pre-release quality control. 

This Safety of Flight issue does create concerns at many levels, at a minimum, that a device recall or AD may be in order...  

Tom W.  


Edited by n7ifr - 09 Dec 2018 at 5:11pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Dec 2018 at 11:20am
So now Avi has a S.B. to "Correct" the spontaneous resetting of the TAS-A Box Volume to the default "201" level, which is inaudible!  The SB solution is to "Lock" the configuration settings...

I went out to hangar, and reset my default Volume setting of 201 up to 415.  Seemed to hold through 2-3 re-boots of the TAS box, so did a flight yesterday - the TAS Traffic alert at 415 is way too loud.

Maybe someone smarter than me can come up with a Panel-Controlled Volume for the TAS Alert.  Look at the TAS Install manual, page 90 which refers to the Avidyne ATI panel Volume Control for the TAS-A box...

Just saying.

Tom W.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Dec 2018 at 11:32am
This is an obvious firmware flaw if settings on any level do an uncommanded change, and the appropriate response would be firmware correction.  Are other settings migrating as well?  Do we know?
David Gates
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Dec 2018 at 12:49pm
Does this volume setting affect all audio alerts, like the "No advisories" message if you press the advice/repeat button, or the "No position" advice, if you are sitting on the ground a long time with the GPS off?

* Orest
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Dec 2018 at 12:58pm
Yes.  You don't hear anything...

The audio is generated but volume is too low to hear.
David Gates
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote oskrypuch Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Dec 2018 at 1:17pm
Well, at least you can defect the issue on the ground then. I have not seen this happen to me, yet.

* Orest
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dryan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Dec 2018 at 3:49pm
My apologies for not being responsive to this thread.  I had been unaware of it until ddgates pointed it out to me.

We are aware that the TAS-A is sometimes reverting to default configuration settings; however, this is the first time I've heard that the default (50%) level was too low to be heard.  We selected a default of 50% to prevent exactly that situation.

As already pointed out, the Service Bulletin (document number 601-00185-010) was published as a stop-gap measure to prevent changes to the installation configuration once it is set.  That service bulletin makes the configuration file read-only, which has been effective at preventing changes to the configuration in other aircraft.

The service bulletin is only intended to be a temporary measure.  We have been trying to identify the source of the problem and fix it properly, but we haven't been able to reproduce the behavior.  This has made it difficult to identify the root cause.

I would be very interested to hear if the service bulletin to lock the configuration does not prevent the configuration from reverting to defaults.  Since this has prevented the problem in other installations it would be a helpful clue to know that it doesn't prevent it in all situations.  Please be sure to check the log produced while performing the steps in the service bulletin to confirm that the configuration file was locked.

My sincere apologies for my delayed response and for the inconvenience the issue has caused.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 2018 at 2:22pm
What we found in my case was the original install had paralleled two outputs (the TAS-A and the AMX-240 audio output) to the same unswitched input, and so when the techs did the adjustments they had to crank the TAS-A audio out to >400 to be heard.  When at bootup (and mine was doing this every time) the audio would drop back to 221 (or whatever it is default) and thus wouldn't hear anything.

We undid the parallel, and now the TAS-A audio is alone on the unswitched input of the PMA450.  It can be heard.

But then, a fellow pilot, same airport, different airplane but same equipment basically as mine (and also recent -A upgrade to TAS605) lost his audio.  Don't know if he had the same install parallel as mine but obviously same, so same problem.

Practically speaking, doing the SB procedure is problematic for me because each time the upholstery has to be removed and multiple parts of the bulkhead have to be undone to expose the unit in the empennage and gain access to the TAS box.  There is double uncertainty about the apparent fragility of the external SD drive (and to some degree, absence of DOS/Unix like manipulations of the avionics technicians.)  So for me solving the input issue was the better choice assuming that it holds up and the problem doesn't drop the config to below the midrange level.

In the case of the Piper pilot I mentioned, don't know what his comm panel connection is but his issue is likely to be similar.

On another note:  we both have other questions about the TAS-A functionality, and have gotten variable answers from different Avi sources.  So, dryan, you are the guru on this system so let me ask this and maybe other questions: 
-To maximixe the functionality of the TAS-A upgrade, and with both TAS-A and MLB-100 units installed, does it serve better to indicate on our TXPs that we have 1090-in or 978-in? I.e., does the TAS-A unit make use of the 978 ADS-R broadcase which we could in theory receive on 1090?

A suggestion as well, dryan.  It seems that (lucky me) my TAS-A box displays the config reversion behavior which you haven't been able to reproduce on every bootup.

You may want to examine or study my box.

Thanks, and happy holidays.


Edited by ddgates - 19 Dec 2018 at 2:25pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 2018 at 2:36pm
DRYAN -

Yes, this TAS-A Audio adjustment is a very inconvenient and problematic issue.  My configuration includes dual IFD540's, and Avidyne Audio Panel and Transponder...

Yesterday, I went to hangar to do the PC-PuTTY configuration to lower the high Audio Volume (set to 415) - Default 205 way too low to hear!  Unfortunately, a more basic recurrent problem occurred, with the TAS-A box spontaneously becoming completely "dead in the water" with only the White-light on the box. 

This is the second time around with this problem, likely once again the internal micro-SD card becoming Corrupt - I understand about 15% of the new TAS-A boxes ...and requiring another trip back to Avidyne... Very frustrating for us customers to have to be the quality control on what should have been R&D issues.  

Hoping for a fix...

Tom W.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 2018 at 2:51pm
Oh, man, I am sorry.

Seems not ready for prime time.

I had the "WHITE LIGHT OF DEATH" on my TAS and it was a blown board, or so they said. 
David Gates
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dryan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 2018 at 3:14pm
I recommend configuring the transponder for 1090 In.  The TAS-A will provide a hybrid view of active TAS, 1090 ADS-B, ADS-R, and TIS-B traffic.  The 978 traffic will be included using the ADS-R rebroadcast.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dryan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 2018 at 3:32pm
I am investigating the white light issue.  Hopefully with the comments everyone is providing we can identify the cause and eliminate both issues.  Having information helps, thanks!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 2018 at 6:15pm
d-Ryan:

Are you related to the "Ryan-TCAD" many of us love?

Assuming "Yes", I weigh your advice on Transponder settings more seriously... 

So, to optimize the new TAS-A box VeriTAS conflict resolution, your recommendation on the 1090 setting makes intuitive sense - Thank You.

The only down side on this would be losing the full "UAT" Display symbology (from Skytrax/MLB 978-In) with Speed/Direction Vectors on traffic targets.  Displaying the TAS-A 1090-In traffic on our IFD540's only displays with Legacy "Diamond" - So Far...  With my dual 540 setup, I will configure #1 to display Ryan-TCAD, and #2 to display Skytrax.

Maybe you will have some input on improving this.

Thanks.

Tom W.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dryan Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 2018 at 10:26pm
Yes, indeed.  I have been involved in the design and development of every model of Ryan/Avidyne TCAD/TAS.  

I don't have any recommendations for improving the traffic display yet, but stand by...we intend to continue improving the TAS-A.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Dec 2018 at 11:58pm
dRyan -
Many of us are out here doing the "R&D"for the TAS-A box, in real time... Let us know what information we can provide you that would be helpful in solving:

   1.  the TAS-A Box "White Light of Death"- my unit will arrive back to Melbourne tomorrow (attn. Mike Clifford).  I assume the likely weak link (Again) is the Internal micro-SD card, spontaneously Corrupting...x2 now for this unit.  

   2. The Spontaneous Reset of the TAS-A Audio Volume to default of "205" (shouldn't be happening, of course) - is too low & inaudible.  Tech support says this happens with integration of Non-Avidyne avionics, but I can assure you, my entire setup is all Avidyne, except for dual Aspens, receiving TAS-A 1090 traffic via ARINC 429 input. 

Please keep us posted.

Thanks.

Tom W.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Dec 2018 at 8:53am
Dean:
Pleased to know you will engage on this.  I think that is the ingredient necessary to get to a fix.

Thanks and happy holidays.
David Gates
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2018 at 6:41pm
Dean -
DGates shared that you might be looking for a TAS-A box to investigate these problems....  
Mine has just been received at Avidyne few days ago, with Unit Exchange.  My new exchange unit, Squawk History unknown.  

My TAS605-A history is:
.  M1329880
.  "White Light of Death" x2 - presumed Corrupt internal micro SD card
.  Spontaneous Audio Reset to Default inaudible levels.

Good luck.
Keep us posted.  Thanks 

Tom Wolf
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Edited by n7ifr - 23 Dec 2018 at 6:41pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote ddgates Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 23 Dec 2018 at 10:35pm
I have adjusted my downstream setup wrt audio to be tolerant of a reset to default TAS audio out volume.  At this point doesn’t seem to matter.  Not known, though, if other config value or values are resetting but undiscovered.

Edited by ddgates - 23 Dec 2018 at 10:36pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote n7ifr Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 10 Jan 2019 at 10:09pm
FYI,

Installed my exchanged TAS605A after second failure (presumed corrupt internal micro-SD card).  So far, so good, working like a charm.
  .  Configured (with PC PuTTY program) to Volume = 400, and holding.

Re-configured Transponder to optimize TAS605-VeriTAS with 1090=Yes, 978=No, and configured my IFD540#1 to display Ryan TCAS, and noticed in the AUX-Audio page:
 A new SLIDER labeled TRAFFIC - Volume for TAS605A now controllable via IFD540 Audio Page!!!

If only Avidyne TEch Support would have known about this...
Life is good.

Tom W. 
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