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Are our IFD units ready for Week Number Rollover?

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CubedRoot View Drop Down
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote CubedRoot Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Topic: Are our IFD units ready for Week Number Rollover?
    Posted: 17 Jan 2019 at 6:06pm
This might be a silly question, but I am curious if our IFD units are ready for the GPS Week Number Rollover that is coming up soon.

Here's some details:  https://www.masterclock.com/company/masterclock-inc-blog/2019-gps-week-number-rollover

I am going to hope and assume they are ready for this as the limitation of 10 bits is nothing new, and I'd hope a highly advanced GPS like the IFD's are is ready to cope with this, since it occurs roughly every ten years.  

But it never hurts to ask just in case...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 2:53pm
The IFDs are not currently ready for the rollover.  Our plan was to include the fix in 10.2.3.1.  But, since we're not sure how long the government shutdown will last, we're considering a minor release specifically to address *only* the rollover.  We believe that we can push a time critical release like that through the system regardless of the shutdown status.  One way or another, we expect to have an update to address the rollover by the end of February.  Look for further official communication regarding this subject in the near future.

We've characterized the effects of the rollover and those effects are all minor.  For example, database names and cycles will be displayed in yellow because the IFD thinks that the database is not effective yet.  Rest assured that the rollover will not affect the ability of the IFDs to perform normal navigational functions.
Steve Lindsley
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote pburger Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Jan 2019 at 3:15pm
Well, it wasn't a silly question!
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AZ Flyer Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jan 2019 at 8:38pm
Originally posted by AviSteve AviSteve wrote:

The IFDs are not currently ready for the rollover.  Our plan was to include the fix in 10.2.3.1.  But, since we're not sure how long the government shutdown will last, we're considering a minor release specifically to address *only* the rollover.  We believe that we can push a time critical release like that through the system regardless of the shutdown status.  One way or another, we expect to have an update to address the rollover by the end of February.  Look for further official communication regarding this subject in the near future.

We've characterized the effects of the rollover and those effects are all minor.  For example, database names and cycles will be displayed in yellow because the IFD thinks that the database is not effective yet.  Rest assured that the rollover will not affect the ability of the IFDs to perform normal navigational functions.

If this could be a simple user update with a usb stick and not involving a trip to the avionics shop (which are all overloaded it seems), that would be greatly appreciated.


Edited by AZ Flyer - 19 Jan 2019 at 8:38pm
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dmtidler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Jan 2019 at 8:46pm
+1
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Paul Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Jan 2019 at 4:05pm
A trip to an avionics shop requires scheduling, takes my time, and I have to pay them for it.  I don't expect that an owner/pilot would be allowed to make such an update to a certificated aircraft but if it an be done and signed off by a local A&P that would make things a bit easier.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D-EACY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 2019 at 8:24am
Does that mean we cannot use the database?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 2019 at 8:36am
The nav database will show as "Not Yet Effective", but will still be completely usable.
Steve Lindsley
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D-EACY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 21 Jan 2019 at 8:37am
That's good news, thank you.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stevei Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Feb 2019 at 11:43am
Steve,

For those Avi users not on the Forum, suggest you send out an email blast to all owners, so they don't freak out when they see the message, and barrage you with calls, emails.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 03 Feb 2019 at 11:46am
Already in progress...
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote tony Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 2019 at 9:42am
Is it only an issue if the units are powered on when this occurs or will all units be affected regardless? 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 2019 at 11:17am
If the unit is powered on when the rollover occurs, it will operate with the correct date for the duration of that power cycle.  Next time you power on, the date will be incorrect.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Flybuddy Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 2019 at 1:48pm
If this is still "up in the air" when the rollover occurs on April 6th, can we pull our IFDs at SunNFun and have you update? (when you're feeding us burgers would be convenient)
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 04 Feb 2019 at 4:37pm
Originally posted by Flybuddy Flybuddy wrote:

If this is still "up in the air" when the rollover occurs on April 6th, can we pull our IFDs at SunNFun and have you update? (when you're feeding us burgers would be convenient)
I can just see it... You hand over your IFD and we ask "Would you like fries with that?"  LOL.

I doubt that we would be able to support a walk-up update service in the booth.  It wouldn't be technically difficult to do the update, but the paperwork, signoffs, etc. probably make it unworkable.  I'll float the idea, but don't count on it.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Feb 2019 at 4:08pm
Here's the official communication on the GPS week rollover fix..

All Avidyne IFDs will require a MANDATORY update to address the GPS week rollover that takes place on April 6, 2019. This update is necessary to maintain proper display of ADS-B and SXM weather as well as other date related functions including proper display of database currency. No GPS/NAV/COM functions are affected. 10.2.x.0.A for 10.2.x.0 is available now to address this issue and 10.2.3.1, when released, will also incorporate this update.

Here are your options for updating the software to address the GPS rollover issue:

1. Update the IFD with 10.2.3.1 when it is released to get the enhancements plus address the GPS rollover date issue.

2. Update the 10.2.x.0 software with 10.2.x.0.A patch to address the GPS rollover date issue only.

3 Update the 10.1.x.0 software with 10.2.2.0.A to address the GPS rollover date issue and bring the IFD to the latest software rev.

FAQs for Software 10.2.x.0.A:

1. What happens to my IFD if I do not update it to address the GPS rollover issue? On April 6th at midnight GMT the system will report the date as being approximately 19 years in the past. Even if you are using a current navigation database, the system will show that the database is not yet valid. If you are using SXM or ADS-B weather, you will lose access to some of your Datalink weather products. NAV/COM functions are not affected.

2. If I am not at 10.2.x.0 what do I need to do to apply the patch to address the GPS rollover issue? You may elect to update your unit to 10.2.2.0.A which must be done by a dealer or you can wait until the 10.2.3.1 release is available and update it at that time.

3. Does an Avidyne authorized dealer have to do the 10.2.x.0.A update? No, anyone who can sign off on a log book entry can provide the 10.2.x.0.A update if your software is at 10.2.x.0. It should take less than 30 minutes to complete the update.

4. Does the GPS rollover issue affect my EX5000, EX500 or EX600? No. However, if those products are interfaced to IFDs or other GPSs that are affected by the date rollover issue then the GPSs must be updated in order to maintain correct date-related functionality on the MFDs.

5. On what date will shipments of new IFDs from Avidyne include the GPS update to address the rollover issue? Any new IFD shipped from Avidyne after Feb. 11, 2019 will not require a software update in order to address the GPS rollover issue.

6. How do I get the 10.2.x.0.A software update? You may request the software update at the link that follows: https://lz314.infusionsoft.com/app/form/gpsrolloverupdate

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Feb 2019 at 4:10pm
Here's a link to the corresponding Service Information Letter (SIL).

https://www.avidyne.com/files/downloads/606-00182-019.pdf

Steve Lindsley
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Stevei Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Feb 2019 at 5:39pm
Steve,

Thanks for info.  I'm not going to be anywhere where I can update to the new version including the rollover fix until mid-May. But I will be flying.
Just so I'm clear on what will happen when I fire it up.
I'll get an error message but all Nav data, obstacle and terrain will be available as always, and the unit will function normally.
Is that right?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote HenryM Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Feb 2019 at 6:21pm
I read the date will be wrong (sometime 19 years ago), so some ADS-B data will not show either. 
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 12 Feb 2019 at 9:21pm
Originally posted by Stevei Stevei wrote:

Steve,

Thanks for info.  I'm not going to be anywhere where I can update to the new version including the rollover fix until mid-May. But I will be flying.
Just so I'm clear on what will happen when I fire it up.
I'll get an error message but all Nav data, obstacle and terrain will be available as always, and the unit will function normally.
Is that right?
Nav, obstacle, and terrain will continue to be usable, but will be displayed in yellow (versus white).  Com/Nav radios will still function normally.  GPS navigation and guidance will still function normally.  Time stamped ADS-B weather won't be displayed.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote alexbrett Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 9:10am
I've read the SIL, but something that isn't clear from it is are the .A releases available and/or approved for use under EASA rules (i.e. in Europe), or just FAA rules?

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 6:12pm
Originally posted by alexbrett alexbrett wrote:

I've read the SIL, but something that isn't clear from it is are the .A releases available and/or approved for use under EASA rules (i.e. in Europe), or just FAA rules?
Sorry for the delay.  I think it's fine worldwide, but I haven't been able to get 100% confirmation from our cert specialist.  I'll post when I get that confirmation.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote teeth6 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 13 Feb 2019 at 6:42pm
For those who use the IFD 100, I'm told to wait until the next release of the app from the App Store before doing the roll over  patch on the panel mount to prevent a problem with the app.  That release should be anytime now.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote edanford Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Feb 2019 at 11:26am
Thanks for the post teeth6.  

I unfortunately updated to 10.2.2.0.A and spent about 40 minutes wondering why my ifd100 would not work.

I verified the new Check Sums about 20 times before giving up.  

Glad to know that the problem is with app update.  I wish that had been in the update instructions.

Ed

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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote teeth6 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Feb 2019 at 11:46am
Ed,  I’d expect the app update to be available from the App Store sometime later today or tomorrow......hopefully.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote dmtidler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 14 Feb 2019 at 11:55am
This brings two IFD100 update questions to mind:

1) Will the next IFD100 release be backwards compatible with IFD4XX/5XX sw:10.2.X.0.A, 10.2.X.0?

2) Will the next IFD100 release still be compatible with iPad iOS 9.1 or greater as it currently is?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote teeth6 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Feb 2019 at 10:38am
The IFD 100 app update is now available in the App Store.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote dmtidler Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Feb 2019 at 10:50am
Just saw new IFD100 release. App Store shows it is compatible with IFD software release 10.2.2.A?? I think they meant 10.2.2.0.A...does that mean it is not compatible with 10.2.1.0.A or backwards compatible with 10.2.0.0, 10.2.1.0, or 10.2.2.0?

BTW - new IFD release still requires iOS 9.1 or later....that answers my question a few posts back.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 15 Feb 2019 at 2:38pm
Originally posted by alexbrett alexbrett wrote:

I've read the SIL, but something that isn't clear from it is are the .A releases available and/or approved for use under EASA rules (i.e. in Europe), or just FAA rules?
Yes, the .A release is a "minor" release so EASA rules are covered by agreements with the FAA.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote allenc3 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 18 Feb 2019 at 6:55pm
I updated my 440 today for the GPS rollover with no issues.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D-EACY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Feb 2019 at 12:47pm
Can i update 2 IFD4403 with the SAME (1) download on 1 USB stick? Or do i have to download the patch twice?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (1) Thanks(1)   Quote teeth6 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 19 Feb 2019 at 12:58pm
You can use the same stick for both units.  
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D-EACY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2019 at 8:25am
Can we use the new IFD100 app with the old firmware in the devices?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2019 at 9:00am
Originally posted by D-EACY D-EACY wrote:

Can we use the new IFD100 app with the old firmware in the devices?
IFD100 app store version 10.2.6 is compatible with all panel mount IFDs 1.2.2.0.A and prior.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D-EACY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2019 at 9:06am
And is it okay if the Pilot/Owner signs off the Firmware Update of the IFDs in the logbook?
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote AviSteve Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2019 at 9:12am
I'll reiterate what I've said on the 10.2.3.1 thread.

A pilot without a maintenance rating cannot legally perform this update except under the supervision of someone who holds that rating and who is prepared to sign off the airplane.  If you can work out an arrangement with someone with an appropriate rating such that you can do the update and they're willing to sign off, then that's legal.

If you have an experimental airplane, you can generally do the update and sign off on your own.  Again, subject to the applicable rules for experimental aircraft.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote Gary L Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2019 at 9:38pm
Can I use the USB stick I now use for the monthly data base updates?  I’m presuming the files don’t interfere with each other.
Perhaps a silly question but just to be sure.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote teeth6 Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 20 Feb 2019 at 10:01pm
Yes you can but it’s always recommended to format the drive before you load new files to it so the patch would be the only thing on the drive.
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Post Options Post Options   Thanks (0) Thanks(0)   Quote D-EACY Quote  Post ReplyReply Direct Link To This Post Posted: 28 Feb 2019 at 2:56pm
Installed the Patch for the GPS week rollover today without a problem om both IFD440s
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